DET-IND

[Ben Wallace]

Detroit Pistons trade:

Pau Gasol $7,769,520

Delon Wright $1,163,000 $1,213,100 $2,058,631 $2,995,308

OKC 2019 1st (lottery protected)



Indiana Pacers trade:


Markieff Morris $13,500,000 $12,000,000 $10,500,000 $9,000,000

IND 2017 1st



I accept, I get a decent big man and a first round pick this year while giving up Pau, who I don't plan on re-signing, some future assets, and have the cap space to absorb Markieff's contract.

[Reggie Miller]

I accept.. I need to unload Morris to re sign Teague this off season while not hurting our chances for a championship this season.

[Justin Timberlake]

Indys 1st is pretty much guaranteed to be non lottery now and by 2019 I doubt OKC's will be any good either. The better pick with the worse player/contract balances out to me for the worse pick with the better player/shorter contract. It also helps that Markieff's contract only gets better.

Accept

[Yeezy]

Thunder team will basically be the same next year so 2019 pick won't any good like JT said. Indy pick is nothing special but def an upgrade over OKC.

Pau > Kieff so Oden gets the pick upgrade. I like Delon a lot but I'm a Raps fan so I'm biased, I'm not sure why he was included but eh fair trade, but I like it a bit more for Reggie due to my infatuation with Delon.

Accept

[Ben Wallace]

Yeezy you in Toronto? Wasn't sure if there were any other Canadians here!

[Yeezy]

Apr 6, 2017 18:11:27 GMT -5 Ben Wallace said:

Yeezy you in Toronto? Wasn't sure if there were any other Canadians here!

Nah I live in NorCal - from Montreal tho.  Where you at?

[Ben Wallace]

Apr 6, 2017 18:32:32 GMT -5 Yeezy said:

Apr 6, 2017 18:11:27 GMT -5 Ben Wallace said:

Yeezy you in Toronto? Wasn't sure if there were any other Canadians here!

Nah I live in NorCal - from Montreal tho.  Where you at?

Oh sweet - I'm in Hamilton for school.

[Deleted]

I accept this trade seems like a good deal. One team gets a younger good player while the other team gets cap relief plus an older good player plus Delon Wright. The two first round picks are close to the same value. 

Im from Canada Ben Wallace I live in Regina

[John Stockton]

Apr 6, 2017 17:34:37 GMT -5 Yeezy said:

Pau > Kieff 

not sure if this is the case. obviously Pau is more talented right now, but he is expiring this off season and Kieff is much younger on a contract that is gonna turn out to be a good deal with the cap rising over the next few years and is also literally 10 years younger.

this doesnt really make sense for indiana if their plan is to cut cap space to resign teague. youre giving up the younger player with more value AND the better pick for a player they only intend to use to 1/4 of the season.

sorry reggie, this is gonna be a reject for me. i think a much better fairer deal for indiana here would be if it involved pau for the indiana pick minus kieff but i probably like markieff much more than anyone here so im sure some may disagree.

Delon Wright is okay i guess but he hasnt really impressed me in some of the games ive watched him when he was getting extended minutes.

[Paul Pierce]

I reject, I agree with John. Kief is on a bargain, you shouldn't be giving up a first and Kief for Pau

[Justin Timberlake]

Apr 6, 2017 20:18:51 GMT -5 Paul Pierce said:

I reject, I agree with John. Kief is on a bargain, you shouldn't be giving up a first and Kief for Pau

Except it's a 1st and Kieff for Pau, a 1st and a prospect.

And if I remember correctly, Reggie has been shopping Kieff for a solid year (if not longer). I'm not sure how much more you could expect for him on that contract?

Also Miami, Atlanta and I are from Saskatoon. Cool to see more fellow Canadians!

[Paul Pierce]

Apr 6, 2017 20:23:42 GMT -5 Justin Timberlake said:

Apr 6, 2017 20:18:51 GMT -5 Paul Pierce said:

I reject, I agree with John. Kief is on a bargain, you shouldn't be giving up a first and Kief for Pau

Except it's a 1st and Kieff for Pau, a 1st and a prospect.

And if I remember correctly, Reggie has been shopping Kieff for a solid year (if not longer). I'm not sure how much more you could expect for him on that contract?

Also Miami, Atlanta and I are from Saskatoon. Cool to see more fellow Canadians!

But his reasoning is to cut salary and he will have no PF if he doesnt resign gasol.

[Yeezy]

Just because you don't like a deal means you have to reject it imo, it doesn't kill his team, let him do what he wants?

[Paul Pierce]

Apr 6, 2017 20:44:42 GMT -5 Yeezy said:

Just because you don't like a deal means you have to reject it imo, it doesn't kill his team, let him do what he wants?

Its gonna hurt his team. I dont think he gets the okc pick Gasol is expiring and wright stinks

[John Stockton]

Altho it should be pointed out that Pau does come with bird rights allowing Indiana freedom to sign teague and BR will allow Reggie to go over cap to resign Pau if he wishes

I still don't like that Indiana doesn't get value back trading for a player that's 10 years older and likely going to demand just as money as kief next year

[Yeezy]

Just because you think Wright stinks, doesn't mean he actually does, CoJo is out next year and he could land into a 20 MPG role.

Let's say he doesn't make this trade and he's stuck with Kieff and doesn't have the cap to resign Teague, so in 17/18 he has
Kieff + his '17 1st which could be something but probably won't.

Or if he makes this trade, instead of Kieff and a question mark, he has Teague, Wright, and a 2019 pick... If you don't like it sure, I don't think not liking a trade makes it vetoable... This helps him possibly get further in the playoffs (Pau is a 68 to Kieff's 64) and helps him, by means of allowing him to resign Teague, be better in 17/18 and lands a nice back up PG (in my opinion), in Wright...

[Reggie Miller]

I have been trading him since the start and no one seems to want him though he has a good contract and plays really well this season. I have recieve many offers but I only want a player who's in a rookie deal or a 1 a player with expiring contract. If I cannot trade Kieff then It's goodbye Teague and even Adams for me cause I will have no cap space to sign them.. I still need to sign Adams for his QO so I really need space.. I already have Love as my primary PF.. I only needed a back up PF next season which I can get in free agency after I sign Teague.. plus I don't have young back up pg so I want Delon Wright. I am not willing to do this trade if I still have my lottery pick but since we won many games and have a chance to win then that pick will no longer be a lottery pick.

[Theodore Duncan]

Accept.

Kieff's contract will be pretty good in coming years, but since Reggie has been shopping him around and has a clear plan why he needs to get more cap space, I don't really see how this would be close to being rejectable. I don't think we should be rejecting too many trades in general, unless it's really lopsided. In this case this is more of an opinion thing, how much a GM likes Pau or Kieff.

And also Pau will help Indiana win few more games this year and with Bird rights he can be still signed (if wanted) after resigning the Teague. Pau still should have at least one more good year left in his tank.

[Steve Jobs]

Apr 7, 2017 0:15:32 GMT -5 Reggie Miller said:

I have been trading him since the start and no one seems to want him though he has a good contract and plays really well this season. I have recieve many offers but I only want a player who's in a rookie deal or a 1 a player with expiring contract. If I cannot trade Kieff then It's goodbye Teague and even Adams for me cause I will have no cap space to sign them.. I still need to sign Adams for his QO so I really need space.. I already have Love as my primary PF.. I only needed a back up PF next season which I can get in free agency after I sign Teague.. plus I don't have young back up pg so I want Delon Wright. I am not willing to do this trade if I still have my lottery pick but since we won many games and have a chance to win then that pick will no longer be a lottery pick.

Reggie, you don't need any cap space to re-sign Teague or Adams. They are both players you traded for so you have bird rights for them.

[Reggie Miller]

Teague has no bird rights

[Steve Jobs]

Yes he does, I fantasy drafted him - this is the third year of his original contract, which means you have his bird rights since you traded for him, and the ability to go over the cap to sign him. Same with Adams.

[billy]

Apr 7, 2017 5:35:44 GMT -5 Steve Jobs said:

Yes he does, I fantasy drafted him - this is the third year of his original contract, which means you have his bird rights since you traded for him, and the ability to go over the cap to sign him. Same with Adams.

Actually Teague was one of the players that was traded before the bird rights rule changed, so he was traded when he had 2 years left on his deal at one point, and so that negated his birds under the old rule. The new rule just says you can trade bird rights, and no one had teagues at that point.Adams also had the same issue. He was traded with 2 years left on his contract before bird rights were tradeable, thus losing his bird rights. When he got traded to Indiana eventually, the cost paid was what is was because it didn't include his bird rights.

(In fact it was you who took Adams bird rights away, by trading him to Detroit on April 6th, 2016 for what you said was a late 1st. The rule change to allow bird right trading happened in May of that year.)

[billy]

The rule change didn't retroactively give players Bird Rights that didn't have them due to being traded; it merely allowed trading of Bird Right's from that point on. To give them out retroactively would fuck teams that traded guys at a reduced rate, due to not being able to trade their Bird's prior to the rule change.

[Steve Jobs]

Apr 7, 2017 9:45:32 GMT -5 billy said:

The rule change didn't retroactively give players Bird Rights that didn't have them due to being traded; it merely allowed trading of Bird Right's from that point on. To give them out retroactively would fuck teams that traded guys at a reduced rate, due to not being able to trade their Bird's prior to the rule change.

If that's the case, then you just changed it to that right now. We had conversations specifically about retroactively giving bird rights back to traded players, because it was always stupid for trades to negate bird rights. As far as I've ever been aware since we changed that, the rule was that all players that were fantasy drafted with at least 3 years on their contract were retroactively given bird rights, and that trades no longer negated bird rights. It doesn't make sense to draw the line for when bird rights could be negated by trades as the exact same moment we established that anybody who started with three years on their contract would get their bird rights back and that trades don't negate bird rights.

[Steve Jobs]

And the roster page agrees with me. Plenty of players with 3+ year who were traded in season 1 are already showing bird rights.

[billy]

Apr 7, 2017 10:07:35 GMT -5 Steve Jobs said:

Apr 7, 2017 9:45:32 GMT -5 billy said:

The rule change didn't retroactively give players Bird Rights that didn't have them due to being traded; it merely allowed trading of Bird Right's from that point on. To give them out retroactively would fuck teams that traded guys at a reduced rate, due to not being able to trade their Bird's prior to the rule change.

If that's the case, then you just changed it to that right now. We had conversations specifically about retroactively giving bird rights back to traded players, because it was always stupid for trades to negate bird rights. As far as I've ever been aware since we changed that, the rule was that all players that were fantasy drafted with at least 3 years on their contract were retroactively given bird rights, and that trades no longer negated bird rights. It doesn't make sense to draw the line for when bird rights could be negated by trades as the exact same moment we established that anybody who started with three years on their contract would get their bird rights back and that trades don't negate bird rights.

Eh, I don't remember those conversations.

[billy]

Apr 7, 2017 10:11:02 GMT -5 Steve Jobs said:

And the roster page agrees with me. Plenty of players with 3+ year who were traded in season 1 are already showing bird rights.

Yeah, players traded during season 1 would be fine, they had 3 years remaining on their contracts. Adams and Teague were traded during season 2. There might be other examples.

If you can find anywhere that I said something previously one way or the other, we'll go with that. I don't remember awarding anyone their bird rights back on purpose due to this rule.

[billy]

Steve Jobs

The only thing I can see that I've posted was this:

dynasty720.proboards.com/post/12272/thread

Which is the thread where we voted on giving players Bird Rights. It was asked if players that were traded and lost them would get them back, and I said no they would not.

[Ben Wallace]

Justin Timberlake Sweet, we're gonna take over :)

Just need one more accept to finalize the trade (or more if rejects)

[Julius Erving]

I'll take Pau over Kieff but Pau is older and expiring even though Kieff has had some injury problems lately so I think that's even.Delon has shown glimpses of what he can do but he's unpredictable, so I'd say the 2019 1st could just be insurance for a maybe (?) top 20 pick in a stacked draft.Both teams get what they want I guess, not a terrible trade (if Morris or Delon was playing a bit better I'd reject it) I accept. Don't think there'll be any major regrets here from either side.